ok,i had warrants in florida while living in pennsylvania.
the warrants in florida are from 2008. i was arrested in pa for an unrelated charge in 2012,the next day while in booking a hold for florida was put on me for the warrants.
i plead to 1 year probation for the Pa charge at my first court appearance i just got in 2012.i was never released until
29 days later when two florida sheriffs extradited me back to florida from the jail in Pa. when i arrived in florida i had a bond and bonded out. so now im on bond in florida for the charges from 2008 and cannot leave the county. im also on probation in Pa and cannot leave Pa,but obviously i cant be in two places at one time.if i leave the county my bond would be revoked, my question is: Can Pa violate my probation even though it is beyond my power or authority to leave florida? its really a catch 22. if the conditions of my probation are i cannot leave the state of Pa than why would the jail allow two sheriffs from Florida to take me out of the jail and fly me to florida? there must be some sort of law to protect me. Also I contacted the Pa probation officer the same day i bonded out of florida and made him aware of the situation. If there is a law or statute for these type of cases that you are aware of can you give me more info?
Thanks Adam
Need Help
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Need Help
by Abornazine » Fri Feb 07, 2014 12:26 am
- Abornazine
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:02 pm
Need Help
by Cydney » Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:14 pm
Hey there, Adam
Interesting questions you pose.
One would think that your probation in PA couldn’t be violated for leaving the state if you were doing so in the custody of deputies who were escorting you to answer for charges in another state. Unfortunately, it can be done.
I have never been proud of this portion of the “Justice System,” but the sad fact is that yes, PA could violate your probation(if they wanted to be buttholes about it) and haul you back to PA on a VOP(Violation of Prob). I’ve seen it happen before, for a variety of reasons; with the main reason being that no one was communicating with anyone else and the probation officer(s) didn’t try to find out the facts before they violated the poor guy on probation!
So here’s the good news and bad news of what you’re dealing with. I’m giving you both, so that you know what you’re up against and so that you know how to protect yourself in every way possible, okay?
Since I'm a rip-the-bandaid-off kinda gal, I'll give you the Bad News first:
1. The only person looking out for your best interests is you!
2. The probation officer in PA can violate you for VOP without considering the other legal troubles you are going through. And that probation officer could merely say “not my problem” when you try to explain to them what’s going on.
3. Your PO in PA doesn’t even have to tell you that s/he is violating you--they just do it and the VOP warrant goes into the system on you.
4. Being on bond in FL, you obviously have some upcoming court dates. IF that PO from PA violates you, you could be taken back into FL custody directly after any court hearings. The charge at that time would be a “Hold for VOP in PA.”
5. IF your PO in PA were to put this VOP on you, it would automatically terminate your bond agreement in the state of Florida and you would be back in jail awaiting the outcome of the FL case, with the additional hold for PA on there, as well.
6. No, there is no statute that keeps one state from violating you when you are taken into custody by another state to answer for charges in that other state.
Okay. Don’t start hyperventilating on me. All of that sound like pretty crappy news, yes, but at least you know the possibilities and can take some steps to protect yourself.
So here’s the Good News:
1. Putting a VOP charge on you would be something a PO would do if he was sneaky & mean-spirited. Not all PO’s are sneaky and dirty. Heck, the majority of them aren’t sneaky and dirty. So hopefully, you’ve gotten one of the PO’s who genuinely want to just do their job and help the people who find themselves in your situation.
2. Of the PO's that become sneaky & mean-spirited, 99% of them didn't start out that way. They got that way because, over the years, so many of their probationers lied to them, got them in trouble and made them look like naive fools. So the PO's learned to be sneaky because most of the people they were dealing with were sneaky. Having said this, PO's can generally tell when someone is trying to pull a fast one and when someone is genuinely trying to keep them informed. Keep up with the communication w/your PO, and even if you end up with one of the sneaky ones, you have a much better chance of them believing that you are trying to do the right thing.
3. You’ve already notified the PO in PA. That’s a good thing. That shows “good intentions” on your part. Please tell me that you have it in writing somewhere….
*** Because of the sticky situation you currently find yourself in, EVERY communication you have with your PO in PA needs to have written documentation.
4. Even if worst-case-scenario happens and you end up getting arrested on a VOP charge, once you went to court on the VOP, the State would say, "oh, okay, we now understand why he violated, so we'll let him go back on probation with special circumstances." Then they would dismiss the VOP charge against you and put you back on probation.
Here are some things you can do to try to protect yourself:
1. If you haven’t already, send the PO in PA your copies of the booking, bond, and release info for the charge in Florida.
** Faxing this info to the PO is a good way to create a “paper trail” to protect yourself with, because you get a fax cover sheet with a date/time stamp of when you sent the information and confirmation that the fax was “successfully” sent.
2. You need to create 3 file folders and keep them with you at all times. Do not rely on someone else to keep these folders for you, because Murphy’s Law states that on the day you need those file folders, the person who is holding them won’t be around. So take care of this yourself for your own sake, please.
The first file folder will hold the contents of the PA case and the outcome of it, along with the Probation papers for that case.
The second file folder will contain all of the paperwork for the Florida case.
The third file folder will contain all of the paperwork for the communication between you and your PO in PA.
Along with the paperwork for each of the subjects, in each of these folders--especially the 2nd & 3rd files-- tape or staple a blank piece of paper on the left-hand side of the file itself.
On that piece of paper, you will begin a “journal” of the date and time you spoke to anyone and you will make notes on what was said.
Here’s an example:
5/6/12, Wed @ 426pm: contacted PO. No answer. Message Left. In the message I said….
5/7/12, Thurs @ 1229pm: contacted PO. Advised him I was sending documentation showing my new court date for the FL case(see documents in this filed marked “court notice”)
5/7/12, Thurs @ 322pm: Faxed PO documentation we spoke about earlier this date. See Fax cover sheet showing successful receipt. Also, called PO to verify he received the fax. He said he did.
Okay, make sense on how to keep notes? And if you need more than one sheet of paper for the notes, just tape or staple another sheet of paper in front of the one that has been used up, but keep the note pages together.
This “journal entry” system for the file folders is the “old school” way that we cops kept up with what we did on cases. It works well and will work well for you, if you keep up with it. Even if you never end up needing the information, it’s all there, just in case!
3. Even though your case in PA is over with, you can try to contact whoever the prosecuting attorney for that case was and let them know what’s going on. Then, tell them that you are just trying to notify everyone you can think of so that you can prevent that worst-case-scenario from occurring. Also, ask them if they have any ideas for you(this is b/c that prosecutor knows the specific laws for PA & may be able to give you more ideas to help you out).
4. If you Are planning on staying in Florida for a while, ask your probation officer in PA if you can get your probation “transferred” to Florida.
5. Expediting a case: Constitutionally, you have a right to have your case expedited. Oftentimes, you get a better plea bargain if you allow the legal system to drag it’s ass, but you do have the option of speeding it up. Like, if your lawyer says that the State of Florida is just going to give you probation, then ask if you can speed that up and have the probation transferred to PA(if you need to get back to PA).
6. If your probation in PA dictates that you need to drop regular UA's or breathalizers, you're going to have to work that out with one of the places in Florida, pay for it, and have the tests results sent to your PO in PA. (and if this is the case, get receipts for ALL pee/breath tests & put them in your folder).
7. If part of your probation is that you do some community service, or, if your PO in PA just wants you to do community service in order to prove you are trying to do the right thing, well, then go to your nearest soup kitchen and volunteer once a week for a few hours. Then, get the supervisor of that soup kitchen to sign their name on something saying you were there.
** This is actually a good way to show that you're not just in FL on bond, living it up, while you're away from your PO in PA. VERY IMPORTANT: All of the prosecutors, PO's, and defense attorneys are juggling a TON of cases. So, as I briefly mentioned above, no one is keeping track of what happens to you except you! This means that the PO in PA might not be talking to the lawyers in Florida, the prosecutor in FL may not know what's going on in PA, and that the prosecutors for VOPs in PA may not know what's going on with you for the State of Florida.
Bottom line: the only way you can protect yourself and make sure everyone is informed is to do it yourself. Do NOT rely on other people to remind anyone of anything in regards to your cases & probations. I've seen people run into trouble time and again because they said "well, I told my PO what was going on..." or, "my attorney should have had that info...".
Please. For your own protection and the safety of your future, make all of the contacts yourself, make all of the contacts more than once, and keep excellent notes.
One last thing: that extra 29 days you sat on your bootie in PA waiting for transport to extradite you? Those 29 days should be applied to any sentence you may receive in FL. So make sure your lawyer in FL is aware of those 29 days, because if your sentence in FL is that you get 30 days in jail plus one year probation, you would get credit for 29 days “time served” and then have to spend one day in the pokie in FL.
Alright, I think I covered everything(I hope). If you have further questions or need clarification on anything I wrote above, feel free to contact me and I’ll be happy to answer.
Good luck to you with this!!
CC
Interesting questions you pose.
One would think that your probation in PA couldn’t be violated for leaving the state if you were doing so in the custody of deputies who were escorting you to answer for charges in another state. Unfortunately, it can be done.
I have never been proud of this portion of the “Justice System,” but the sad fact is that yes, PA could violate your probation(if they wanted to be buttholes about it) and haul you back to PA on a VOP(Violation of Prob). I’ve seen it happen before, for a variety of reasons; with the main reason being that no one was communicating with anyone else and the probation officer(s) didn’t try to find out the facts before they violated the poor guy on probation!
So here’s the good news and bad news of what you’re dealing with. I’m giving you both, so that you know what you’re up against and so that you know how to protect yourself in every way possible, okay?
Since I'm a rip-the-bandaid-off kinda gal, I'll give you the Bad News first:
1. The only person looking out for your best interests is you!
2. The probation officer in PA can violate you for VOP without considering the other legal troubles you are going through. And that probation officer could merely say “not my problem” when you try to explain to them what’s going on.
3. Your PO in PA doesn’t even have to tell you that s/he is violating you--they just do it and the VOP warrant goes into the system on you.
4. Being on bond in FL, you obviously have some upcoming court dates. IF that PO from PA violates you, you could be taken back into FL custody directly after any court hearings. The charge at that time would be a “Hold for VOP in PA.”
5. IF your PO in PA were to put this VOP on you, it would automatically terminate your bond agreement in the state of Florida and you would be back in jail awaiting the outcome of the FL case, with the additional hold for PA on there, as well.
6. No, there is no statute that keeps one state from violating you when you are taken into custody by another state to answer for charges in that other state.
Okay. Don’t start hyperventilating on me. All of that sound like pretty crappy news, yes, but at least you know the possibilities and can take some steps to protect yourself.
So here’s the Good News:
1. Putting a VOP charge on you would be something a PO would do if he was sneaky & mean-spirited. Not all PO’s are sneaky and dirty. Heck, the majority of them aren’t sneaky and dirty. So hopefully, you’ve gotten one of the PO’s who genuinely want to just do their job and help the people who find themselves in your situation.
2. Of the PO's that become sneaky & mean-spirited, 99% of them didn't start out that way. They got that way because, over the years, so many of their probationers lied to them, got them in trouble and made them look like naive fools. So the PO's learned to be sneaky because most of the people they were dealing with were sneaky. Having said this, PO's can generally tell when someone is trying to pull a fast one and when someone is genuinely trying to keep them informed. Keep up with the communication w/your PO, and even if you end up with one of the sneaky ones, you have a much better chance of them believing that you are trying to do the right thing.
3. You’ve already notified the PO in PA. That’s a good thing. That shows “good intentions” on your part. Please tell me that you have it in writing somewhere….
*** Because of the sticky situation you currently find yourself in, EVERY communication you have with your PO in PA needs to have written documentation.
4. Even if worst-case-scenario happens and you end up getting arrested on a VOP charge, once you went to court on the VOP, the State would say, "oh, okay, we now understand why he violated, so we'll let him go back on probation with special circumstances." Then they would dismiss the VOP charge against you and put you back on probation.
Here are some things you can do to try to protect yourself:
1. If you haven’t already, send the PO in PA your copies of the booking, bond, and release info for the charge in Florida.
** Faxing this info to the PO is a good way to create a “paper trail” to protect yourself with, because you get a fax cover sheet with a date/time stamp of when you sent the information and confirmation that the fax was “successfully” sent.
2. You need to create 3 file folders and keep them with you at all times. Do not rely on someone else to keep these folders for you, because Murphy’s Law states that on the day you need those file folders, the person who is holding them won’t be around. So take care of this yourself for your own sake, please.
The first file folder will hold the contents of the PA case and the outcome of it, along with the Probation papers for that case.
The second file folder will contain all of the paperwork for the Florida case.
The third file folder will contain all of the paperwork for the communication between you and your PO in PA.
Along with the paperwork for each of the subjects, in each of these folders--especially the 2nd & 3rd files-- tape or staple a blank piece of paper on the left-hand side of the file itself.
On that piece of paper, you will begin a “journal” of the date and time you spoke to anyone and you will make notes on what was said.
Here’s an example:
5/6/12, Wed @ 426pm: contacted PO. No answer. Message Left. In the message I said….
5/7/12, Thurs @ 1229pm: contacted PO. Advised him I was sending documentation showing my new court date for the FL case(see documents in this filed marked “court notice”)
5/7/12, Thurs @ 322pm: Faxed PO documentation we spoke about earlier this date. See Fax cover sheet showing successful receipt. Also, called PO to verify he received the fax. He said he did.
Okay, make sense on how to keep notes? And if you need more than one sheet of paper for the notes, just tape or staple another sheet of paper in front of the one that has been used up, but keep the note pages together.
This “journal entry” system for the file folders is the “old school” way that we cops kept up with what we did on cases. It works well and will work well for you, if you keep up with it. Even if you never end up needing the information, it’s all there, just in case!
3. Even though your case in PA is over with, you can try to contact whoever the prosecuting attorney for that case was and let them know what’s going on. Then, tell them that you are just trying to notify everyone you can think of so that you can prevent that worst-case-scenario from occurring. Also, ask them if they have any ideas for you(this is b/c that prosecutor knows the specific laws for PA & may be able to give you more ideas to help you out).
4. If you Are planning on staying in Florida for a while, ask your probation officer in PA if you can get your probation “transferred” to Florida.
5. Expediting a case: Constitutionally, you have a right to have your case expedited. Oftentimes, you get a better plea bargain if you allow the legal system to drag it’s ass, but you do have the option of speeding it up. Like, if your lawyer says that the State of Florida is just going to give you probation, then ask if you can speed that up and have the probation transferred to PA(if you need to get back to PA).
6. If your probation in PA dictates that you need to drop regular UA's or breathalizers, you're going to have to work that out with one of the places in Florida, pay for it, and have the tests results sent to your PO in PA. (and if this is the case, get receipts for ALL pee/breath tests & put them in your folder).
7. If part of your probation is that you do some community service, or, if your PO in PA just wants you to do community service in order to prove you are trying to do the right thing, well, then go to your nearest soup kitchen and volunteer once a week for a few hours. Then, get the supervisor of that soup kitchen to sign their name on something saying you were there.
** This is actually a good way to show that you're not just in FL on bond, living it up, while you're away from your PO in PA. VERY IMPORTANT: All of the prosecutors, PO's, and defense attorneys are juggling a TON of cases. So, as I briefly mentioned above, no one is keeping track of what happens to you except you! This means that the PO in PA might not be talking to the lawyers in Florida, the prosecutor in FL may not know what's going on in PA, and that the prosecutors for VOPs in PA may not know what's going on with you for the State of Florida.
Bottom line: the only way you can protect yourself and make sure everyone is informed is to do it yourself. Do NOT rely on other people to remind anyone of anything in regards to your cases & probations. I've seen people run into trouble time and again because they said "well, I told my PO what was going on..." or, "my attorney should have had that info...".
Please. For your own protection and the safety of your future, make all of the contacts yourself, make all of the contacts more than once, and keep excellent notes.
One last thing: that extra 29 days you sat on your bootie in PA waiting for transport to extradite you? Those 29 days should be applied to any sentence you may receive in FL. So make sure your lawyer in FL is aware of those 29 days, because if your sentence in FL is that you get 30 days in jail plus one year probation, you would get credit for 29 days “time served” and then have to spend one day in the pokie in FL.
Alright, I think I covered everything(I hope). If you have further questions or need clarification on anything I wrote above, feel free to contact me and I’ll be happy to answer.
Good luck to you with this!!
CC
- Cydney
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:19 am
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